Friday, September 26, 2014

Consent Counts!

What does consent mean? Listen to the song! Sing along!
Think about how precious your consent is and what you need to know to give it to someone.
song: "Only with your consent" by Jack and Dean

Tuesday, June 24, 2014

Discussion by Genny

Genny Clary: so happy to see you all here

 Genny Clary: my name is genny clary for those who do not know me and I will be leading you in this

discussion on Domination and submission in SL

Genny Clary: I have some things to present and then I will open up for some questions and discussion. At

the conclusion, you are free to remain here and begin a voice/text talk further exploring the topic.

 A little bit about Journey. Journey is a community based on the love and respect we have for the D/

s lifestyle. The people that live on these two sims and who come here are committed to kindness and

tolerance. There is no judgment here at Journey, we ask for respect and tolerance of all that come here.

We boast two galleries and a Gallery Annex of learning. The sims are open and free for you to enjoy, but

please respect the private homes.

The sim is the home of the Orchid Society, a group of Dominants and subs that choose to work together

for mutual pleasure.

If you want any information on either the groups or the sims, please contact me after the discussion.

Before we begin, I want to set a few guidelines. In order to be fair and give all a chance to speak, please

type a @ if you have a question or comment and wait until I call on you. When you are finished with

your response please state “done” or type a # so we can move on. And always be respectful.

Genny Clary: there is a large community of Dominants and submissives in SL and many many sims

For some ... they find a community and settle down, others search and search trying to learn all they can

Still others give up. There is also a large community in RL and they have the same issues

Genny Clary: a few stats ... I promise not too many

It is a study done by Dr Gloria G Brame PhD, which was revised in February of 2000.

These stats are on BDSM, Dominants and subs are a part of that group.

Genny Clary: question ... do you need to practice BDSM to be Dominant or submissive?

Person 1: no, I don’t feel you need to be in an active dynamic to BE submissive or dominant, you

are who you are, period. But for me, it certainly helps to keep me centered and better focused. I AM

submissive, and have been my whole life.

Genny Clary: thank you ... well said

Person 2: No, It is a personality type.

Genny Clary nods in agreement, thank you.

Genny Clary: and Person 1 you brought up a good point. You don’t need to identify with a particular

group and that is more confusing to new comers.

So now the stats for BDSM

Break up of gender in BDSM:

Females - 43%

Males - 57%

Sexual Orientation:

Heterosexual - 68%

Bisexual - 21%

Gay Male - 4%

Lesbian female - 4%

Only 14% of the community is between 18 and 25. The group between 26 and 40 make up the biggest

percentage (47%). Between the ages 41 and 59 make up approximately 37% of the demographic.

This study was done in 2000, I think the age is shifting up.

An interesting point about education,

Respondents in the survey used as a basis for these statistics indicated that at least 57% of them had

at least some college education or had a college degree. A further 20% have post-graduate education

as opposed to only 12% of the respondents that had no education above high school level. Not that

education is the only indicator of intelligence but this shows a level of curiosity and accomplishment in

many members of this community.

We are an intelligent group and always seeking knowledge.

And some of the myths about us include violence and substance abuse.

When asked whether there was domestic violence in their homes while growing up 64% of the

respondents said no, while 32% indicated that yes it had happened. In their own homes 91% indicated

no and 9% said yes. This proves that there isn't a larger percentage of abused people in the lifestyle and

that BDSM is not about abuse at all.

There are many other questions amongst which the questions of substance abuse. A big percentage

(over 80%) of people in BDSM would never touch drugs or any other addictive substances because this

endangers both people in a scene.

Person 3: Was there a sample of vanilla folks also? a control group?

Genny Clary: the first question was to all. The others were directed to the group that claimed to be

practitioners. Good question and that brings up a good point. Statistics can be manipulated. It should

never be used as a basis of any decision.

The other interesting statistics are that only 5% of all participants in BDSM, at least according to

this survey, is polyamorous, while 38% is permanently partnered or married. 70% of all respondents

indicated that they have been with 1 to 5 partners in the last year. This indicates that a lot of

practitioners you will meet are monogamous and do value loyalty.

Genny Clary: ok.... so what I just gave you. I got it from the internet, as could you. But that is not

enough, you want to know what to know. We seek every day to learn. We want to understand the

feelings inside us.

Person 4: Sounds like the vanilla world is a bit abnormal to me!

Genny Clary: laughs .... yep as far as we are concerned.

Genny Clary: you have this feelings and you come to SL and suddenly there are people that seem to

know it all.

What do you do? Where do you go? Anyone ever did a search on BDSM in SL? Hundreds and hundreds

of places. ... and for someone new ? Overwhelming.

So what is the first step? Well I recommend reading first. Look online. The Wikipedia ... the answer to all

BDSM has become an umbrella term for certain kinds of erotic behavior between consenting adults.

There are various subcultures under this umbrella term and distinct difference between these

subcultures. Terminology for roles varies widely within the various BDSM subcultures. Top and

dominant are widely recognized for those partner(s) in the relationship or activity who are, respectively,

the physically active or controlling participants. Bottom and submissive are widely recognized terms

for those partner(s) in the relationship or activity who are, respectively, the physically receptive or

controlled participants. The interaction between tops and bottoms—where physical and/or mental

control of the bottom is surrendered to the top—is sometimes known as power exchange, whether in

the context of an encounter or a relationship.

Genny Clary: laughs .... that was a joke

Person 2: whew

Genny Clary: But you can find a start there. There are books out there, magazine articles, and blogs. So

what does that reading do? It makes you more confused

There is a secret. Don’t think about what you read.... feel it. The facts are the facts and can be changed.

How did reading that article make you feel? Did that book trigger something inside?

Person 5: "I am confused, therefor I am"

Genny Clary smiles gleefully! Yes! Yes!

Knowledge is one thing... but it is nothing if you don’t feel it. One of the exercises I use in mentoring

is having the person look at BDSM images and talk about how they made them feel. Do the same with


Come to an erotic reading ...that these two are giving tomorrow and how does it make you feel ?

Ok... so those feelings are stirred.... Dominant... Submissive ... doesn’t matter. Now what?

So you want to explore being a Dom or a sub. Walk into a room and point to a girl and yell "kneel to me”

How's that work for you?

Person 7: chuckles.

Genny Clary: looks at the Doms

Person 7: Works better if you use all caps. :|

Person 6: Surprisingly well in certain sims.

Genny Clary: good point and we will get to that

Person 6: and you get what you pay for.

Genny Clary: And for the girls ... slip up to a man and cry "collar me" Works for you?

Person 6: <- feels a Domly need to flee

Genny Clary: Has anyone experienced those things or seen them?

Person 8: Have experienced and seen.....Not my idea of anything good, personally.

Genny Clary: Ok so some guidelines; Read and feel are the beginning. Go to places... sims ... look for

people. Well avatars that represent people. Real people, that talk to you not at you, that don’t make

demands. Doms and subs are people ... real and good people.

Person 7: I have learned that anyone who jumps right to anything sexual or collaring within 1'st 15 min

or so is what I think of as a gamer who isn't interested in anything that’s 'real'.

Person 1: chokes

Genny Clary: so very true.

Person 1: 15 mins? jeeze . make it 15 days and i'm STILL thinking that

Genny Clary: The places that have a lot of demands on how a Dom or sub should act is one I would

question, because it is about people first.

Genny Clary: And no one ... let me repeat NO ONE has the right to tell you what you are and question

what you are by the way you act. So look for people and talk about it. Talk about Doms to Doms and

subs to subs, then switch it around. Attend discussions and do so with a bit of cynicism. There are as

many Right ways as there are people in SL. Keep an open mind and listen to all opinions.

Person 6: <- ponders the "One True Way" but then realizes that was at a different sim

Genny Clary: laughs ... if you find the one true way ... run, fast.

Genny Clary: we all have our own true way ... it is our Journey

Person 5: That’s one of the hardest parts here in sl, you know who and what you are but how to figure

out if the other is who/what they are saying they are. I mean how to tell if they are treating this as game

or if they really feel this rl?

Genny Clary: good question

Genny Clary: i can only answer for me.... SL is not a real world ... people can be what they want to be ...

so how can you tell.... time, time, time. Spend time and listen to them, be cautious yet open. Ask them...

is this a game to you?

Genny Clary: You know, it is ok if it is. But be honest.

Person 2: Like many areas of life, I think the first step is to accept and like "yourself". I have talked

with some who think their involvement in the lifestyle is abnormal..........I have been fortunate to have

traveled extensively and visited many countries and studied human history........the history says that D/

s and BDSM activities have been part of the human fabric for eons. I think only in the last 300-400 years

has been relegated to the shadows. I think it is well within the normal range of human it

average? it normal - YES.

Genny Clary: applauds, well said. It has been around since the beginning of time and the religious

aspects are subject for another discussion.

Person 5: I think it’s important not to go too hard on the RP types. Or to judge them... in my experience

it often comes down to miscommunication, a difference of expectations. And with a little effort it is

usually possible to bridge the gap and understand where the other person is coming from. Having said

that... there are still those whole intentionally will mislead... but that is a different thing.

Genny Clary: I agree with you and thank you for your comment. SL for some is a game and there is

nothing wrong with that. So for those that want to explore the world rp can be a good experience. There

are many sims that have good rp groups that allow you to explore your feelings. Again I caution on too

strict. Uou need to be able to explore.

Person 5: in my experience many people enter power exchange via RP... They explore... after a time the

feelings start to become real and they evolve... start to move into other forms of power exchange. In

fact I would say in SL the majority of those in the lifestyle came in this way.

Genny Clary nods and that is a good point.

Genny Clary: my last point is for you to find a good mentor or training group and that goes to the last

comment also. A good group will give you options and help you grow. The key is to remember it is your

Journey ... not the mentors ... the mentor or trainer should guide not demand.

Person 5: watch for waterfowl mentors. They tend to throw you in the deep end... swim or sink :)

 Genny Clary: finding a mentor is easy, finding a good mentor is hard. Look for someone that stimulates

you and has expectations. Someone that lets you explore while asking questions and lighting the path.

Talk to others, but most of all ... don’t give up. There are many wonderful people in the lifestyle and

you ... if you have those feelings deserve the chance to explore them.

Genny Clary: thank you all for attending

Wednesday, February 26, 2014

Discussion on collars by Klaudia

Klaudia Sparta: Welcome warmly All to Journey to Domination and submission
Klaudia Sparta: My name is Klaudia Langer and I will host for you discussion on collar and concept behind collaring. To shortly introduce myself...I am submissive of Master TonyGreg Sparta and dominant of Sjoerd. So I guess you may say I am a switch.
Klaudia Sparta: I have not been hosting discussion for a long time for which i am sorry. i hope you can forgive me, will try to do better
Klaudia Sparta: Please note it's not a class, nor a lecture and I am not a teacher here, just facilitator.
Klaudia Sparta: Discussion is in text only.
Klaudia Sparta: If you wish to comment, please type "C", if you have a question, please type "Q". If your statement is longer, please indicate that you are going to carry on by typing "(more)" or "...".
Klaudia Sparta: When you finished, please type done.
Klaudia Sparta: Please not that English is not mz language, so please bear with me when I need more time
Klaudia Sparta: Be respectful and try not to interrupt. Respect each others opinion even if you don't agree with the particular point of view.
Klaudia Sparta: I would like to request from you to answer straight to the question which is currently asked. Lets not try to digress, but stick to the topic.
Klaudia Sparta: Let me start with simple question.
Klaudia Sparta: What the collar is for you?
Person: c
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: Sir P, go ahead please
Klaudia Sparta smiles at him and listens to his statement
Klaudia Sparta: welcome M
Person: Hello M , welcome and please have a seat
Person smiles at M
Person: Hi M
Sjoerd Amdahl waves at M
Person: c
Person: I dont think thats a simple question at all ... a collar to me is a very complex thing symbolizing strength and unity between D and s, symbolizing the same things a marriage ring does in many cases, loyalty, strength, unity, being bound to one another in a dance of ages
Person: hello M
Person: Good day A/all
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta nods to Sir "is there more?"
Person nods politely
Person: nods in agreement
Person: yes sorry I hit enter lol
Klaudia Sparta: thank you so much for your input Sir!
Person: And hello Sir T, Klaudia, K and N
Person: Im not done
Klaudia Sparta: yes, it's not simple question, I agree:)
Klaudia Sparta: L? you have the floor now
Person waits for her Papi to finish...
Person: also since a collar can be many things to any one person depending on the relationship it is hard to think of what it might mean to someoen else, what it means to me, and my babygirl here may even differ
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you again Sir:)
Person giggles and agrees with her Papi, "I don't think I'd call it a simple question either... but to me the collar is comfort. It shows my commitment and makes helps me feel at home in my role."
Klaudia Sparta: L, your turn
Person: Done
Person: Q
Klaudia Sparta: comfort...lovely commitment...loyalty, yes, so many things... thank you L and Sir
Klaudia Sparta: A?
Person: yes Miss
Person: um...
Klaudia Sparta: you wished to give input?
Klaudia Sparta giggles
Person: the collar to girl is 2 things........
Klaudia Sparta listens
Person: um...
Person: may 3 not sure....
Klaudia Sparta smiles, looking at A and listening
Klaudia Sparta: tell me what it is to you, dear
Klaudia Sparta: as we all have different opinions, being different people
Person: 1st its a physical means of control and the wearer can decide on how it is used when not owned.
Person: .....
Klaudia Sparta nods softly, listening
Person: 2nd it represent the only thing a slave truly owns, her gift of submission, in allowing Her Domme to become Owner, she offers herself completely to that Domme....
Klaudia Sparta: wearer when not owned has choice on how the collar will be used, interesting point, A.... awww, I love 2nd - gift of submission...nods...listening
Person: 3rd... it is symbol of trust that the Owner will care for girl and respect in the girl respects the Domme and will obey Her in all things without question because she trust her Owner
Klaudia Sparta smiles
Person: very well put A .
Person: done
Person blushes
Klaudia Sparta: thank you A:) well put
Klaudia Sparta: K?
Person: A collar to me is simply a symbol .. to a girl that she is owned, and to show others that one is owned. In my view, only as this applies, no more or no less. It is whats within that truly binds one to her Master. Ones bond connects them, not metal, or leather, around ones neck..... Done.
Klaudia Sparta: thank you so much K!
Klaudia Sparta: And now Sir S has a question...
Person: are we talking sl or rl collars?
Sjoerd Amdahl nods in agreement with Kaiti
Klaudia Sparta: both, Sir S
Person: in SL from my point of veiw a collar means one of two things, that a girl is either displaying her penchant for things bdsm or that it is a symbol of a bond between her and another guy, the first makes her usually available for rp, given consent. the second makes her unavailable and forbidden fruit....maybe good for a game of dominoes. i dont attempt to give a collar in sl, i'm just not online enough to hold a relationship of any kind down in sl
Klaudia Sparta: nods...collar means responsibility and devoting your time...
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: done, Sir S?
Person: sorry yes
Klaudia Sparta: thank you Sir, N?
Person: Having a collar and being collared are two entirely different things. I have a collar but have never been collared.
Person: Done
Klaudia Sparta: mmmm interesting point
Person: nods
Klaudia Sparta: this makes me ask another question, which I planned to ask later...
Klaudia Sparta: As unowned submissive do you prefer to wear the collar (for practical functions of it) or you prefer to keep your neck bare?
Person winks at N
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: N, go ahead please
Person: I got used to wearing at Roissy VdO so it is natural for me to keep it on now but access is now very restricted
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you N, anyone else?
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: A?
Sjoerd Amdahl smiles
Sjoerd Amdahl: c
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta smiles at her Boy and K
Person: My point of view?
Person smiles warmly toward Klaudia
Klaudia Sparta: M, please use C if you wish to speak, i will call your name when time comes
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta smiles at M "thank you, noted"
Person: I am unowned but seomtimes I think wearing my collar makes me look or feel needy. I am learning not to be so hungery thanks to a mentor I have. I don't wear it so a domme is attracted to me by how I look and not because of my collar.
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta: awww thank you so much for sharing this very interesting input
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: and I am happy you have wise mentor *hugs*
Klaudia Sparta: Sj?
Sjoerd Amdahl: I used to always wear a collar, even when not owned, as it would make it easier to interact in some sims, but at this time I would perhaps wear it less visbily. Not that it would be needed of course, as I am super proud to wear Yours, everyone can see! :)
Sjoerd Amdahl: done
Klaudia Sparta smiles, listening
Klaudia Sparta: thank you my Boy, K?
Person: c
Person: I wear a collar as a submissive to the Sade .. and also for my Mentor and Protector, Sir T. If I were not in either place, I would not wear it. I see no point in pretending to be collard in sl .. any more than in rl.
Klaudia Sparta: nods to K, smiling at her
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: is there more, Darling?
Person: sorry .. done
Klaudia Sparta: M?
Person: I'm wearing a collar even when unowned - at that state it is just a statement: showing my awareness about my place in life - and a tool for handling animations. That changes dramatically when I am actually owned.
Klaudia Sparta nods, listening
Person: brb
Person: when unowned it is made clear in my profile. done.
Klaudia Sparta: thank you M for the input
Person nods to M
Klaudia Sparta: Sir P?
Person: interestingly I know a great many people who pit on collars so NOT to draw attention, particularly in gor sims, but not only them ... and to keep people from asking to collar them ... and please call me T .. Done
Person nods.. smiling
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: sure, T:) thank you for input
Klaudia Sparta: A?
Person giggles up at her Papi.
Person: sorry what I said was not accurate......
Person:: I do wear my collar all the time ..I just hide it from view because of what I said before. I wear it with public access to give Dommes immidate access should they need it
Person: sorry for misleadning you...done
Klaudia Sparta: no worried sweet A
Klaudia Sparta: ok...What is velcro collar?
Person blushes and looks down
Person: C
Klaudia Sparta: wb Sir and go ahead
Person: something usually frownd upon, but i personaly have no issues with as long as both parties understand
Person: sl is a transient world people come here for excitment
Klaudia Sparta listens to Sir
Person: that doesnt mean that some relationships can be long and fruitful
Klaudia Sparta: welcome D!
Person: done
Sjoerd Amdahl: hi D
Person: Hello D , welcome
Person: Hello Master T
Klaudia Sparta: thank you Sir S, good point
Person: Hello Sirs
Person: Ladys
Klaudia Sparta: anyone else wants to explain velcro aspect?
Person: C
Person: Oh - sorry... I have to leave. A resident needs some help. Not sure if I can make it back in time. Thank you for the invite. See Y/you all soon!
Klaudia Sparta: My Master?
Klaudia Sparta: take care M
Sjoerd Amdahl take care M
Person waves to A/all and darts
Person: Bye M
Person: c
Person: to me they are like women panties , you wear them when needed and not when not needed ,.. just my view and how i see them
Person: hello D
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta laughs
Klaudia Sparta: thank You my Master haha
Person giggles at the image.
Klaudia Sparta: K?
Person: A velcro collar is a quick and temporary game played between those wishing to act as M/s in my opinion. They don't last long and they don't mean much. slapped on and and quickly disposed of.
Klaudia Sparta nods in agreement to K, listens
Klaudia Sparta: (done?)
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you K:)
Klaudia Sparta: Do you wear the collar also when you are on vanilla sims? If so - how vanilla people react when noticing the collar? Do they notice it at all?
Sjoerd Amdahl: c
Klaudia Sparta: my Boy?
Person: c
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta smiles seeing so many Cs
Sjoerd Amdahl: I usually don't take it off, only hide it when visiting a maledom sim with You. And people dont seem to notice is my experience, or maybe they don't really care on vanilla sims. At least I dont look like a dragon or a monster or something
Sjoerd Amdahl: so it does not really stand out I think
Sjoerd Amdahl: done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you my Boy:)
Klaudia Sparta: N?
Person: Mine looks more like a choker than a collar, I only get comments if my profile is read. Done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you N
Klaudia Sparta: L?
Person: I do... but I feel like in SL most people recognize it... whether they understand it or realize the meaning behind it... they are just used to seeing it and it's still a reflection of my choices.
Person: done
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: thank you so much L
Klaudia Sparta: T?
Person: In SL as well so many clothes have collars or sollarlike objects added to them I think a Collar is truly invisable unless you are looking for it, My babygirl here doesnt have hers visable at work since she is a courtesian and it could affect her clients seeing her as free. But she wears it all other places. Done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you so much for sharing, T
Klaudia Sparta: Since we are discussing vanilla people..let me quote you something funny from my personal blog, as anecdote...
Klaudia Sparta: "I went to marketplace today and I halted near the stall where the man was selling some things for pets... I came little closer and my hand automatically, wantonly reached out to trace beautiful dog's collar... I could not resist imagining myself in it and I closed my eyes for a moment... I trembled, thinking it would be lovely to wear it just for a few minutes when I kneel for my Master ...(...) I almost jumped when I heard masculine voice all of the sudden: "this one costs 10, Ma'am". I instantly opened my eyes and blinked realizing I am standing there with the dog's collar in my hand... I looked at the man completely embarrassed, like he could read my mind... I mumbled bashfully "oh, thank you for the information Sir". He smiled at me and I covered in blush when I heard his next question "so how big is your dog?". I gasped for a moment thinking frantically what to answer and I eventually said "well, it's not for my dog". I gently put the collar back on its place and made all the effort for my smile to 
Klaudia Sparta: look naturally and said "please excuse me Sir, have a nice day". And I slooowly scampered away!"
Sjoerd Amdahl grins
Person: lol
Sjoerd Amdahl c
Klaudia Sparta: yes my Boy
Person giggles.
Sjoerd Amdahl I really wonder if the guy even knew what You were talking about my Lady, perhaps he just thought You had a big cat at home or something... ;)
Person smiles
Sjoerd Amdahl: done
Klaudia Sparta: LOL
Klaudia Sparta: I have no idea what he was thinking and I rather not find out....lets move to next question!
Sjoerd Amdahl nods
Klaudia Sparta: What would you answer if vanilla person seeing your collar asked you: "is that a dog's collar?"
Sjoerd Amdahl perhaps he was interested in putting it on You ;)
Klaudia Sparta: lol Sj, shh
Sjoerd Amdahl sorry my Lady
Sjoerd Amdahl blushes
Person: i'm sorry i have to go...nice seeing you all again and thanx fopr the disscussion klaudia
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: so how any of you would react hearing such question?
Klaudia Sparta: K?
Klaudia Sparta: take care Sir S!
Sjoerd Amdahl: c
Person: Do take care S
Sjoerd Amdahl: take care S
Person: bye Sir S
Person: It is my collar.. and it is whatever my Master wishes it to be. Would be simple as that. Done
Person: @
Sjoerd Amdahl: -c
Sjoerd Amdahl: :)
Klaudia Sparta: yes K. The problem arrives when they don't know what Master means...and what it is all about
Klaudia Sparta: Sj?
Person: c
Sjoerd Amdahl: I think I would answer it is a gift for someone else's dog or something, but it is interesting how innocent objects can feel strange to us as we think about D/s
Sjoerd Amdahl: or not strange...
Person: please excuse girl she is needed elsewhere
Person: c
Sjoerd Amdahl: but they have a different meaning
Klaudia Sparta: take care A:)
Klaudia Sparta listens to her Sj
Sjoerd Amdahl: its like buying clothespins a bit as well I guess, or candles
Klaudia Sparta: or ginger...
Sjoerd Amdahl: super innocent... yet... :)
Sjoerd Amdahl: tiger balm
Sjoerd Amdahl: list goes on and on
Sjoerd Amdahl: done
Person: take care A
Klaudia Sparta ...nods
Person: @.. c?
Person: D?
Klaudia Sparta: When D is done, K, then L:)
Person: if it would be a person who dont know me.. i would yes.. yes of course do you like it its the newest i have seen it in Paris or something like that
Klaudia Sparta laughs
Person: lol D ..
Klaudia Sparta: I love it:)
Person: if it would be a person i know well and the person knows me well... .....
Person grins
Person: q
Person: it would be another thing..
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you D!
Klaudia Sparta: K?
Person: I find that in this day and age .. even the most vanilla person is not stupid, nor clueless that D/s exist in the world. If they wish further information, then I answer as best I can to help them understand.
Person: in response to your comment after mine Klaudia. Done
Sjoerd Amdahl smiles
Klaudia Sparta: thank you K!
Klaudia Sparta: L?
Person: I find it interesting that in RL... my 13 year old daughter wore a dog collar every day for a year. It was interesting when people asked her why... she just replied that it was her security blanket. I'm still not sure if she understood the D/s meaning of it... but it was a token in her eyes from her girlfriend. I had a real problem at first with it... feeling like someone might think of her in terms of a submissive.... but realized she's a kid and I can't read too much into it. Done.
Person: awwww thats sweet
Klaudia Sparta: awww again L, thank you for sharing
Klaudia Sparta: T?
Person: I hate o ask this but im perplexed ... ginger? Done
Klaudia Sparta laughs
Sjoerd Amdahl smiles
Person: we shall talk about it later T lol
Person chuckles
Person: O.o
Klaudia Sparta: well...yes...ginger is known for it's special skills...and yes, I will tell you later T:)
Klaudia Sparta giggles
Sjoerd Amdahl: it tastes good :)
Klaudia Sparta: Collars can take many forms. They can be made of leather, they can be necklaces, they can be simple jewelery chains. They can be locked in place by Owner who keeps the key. But does collar have to be something what you put around your neck only?
Person: feels sorry for L if he wish to try it .. smiles
Klaudia Sparta: lol, me too
Sjoerd Amdahl: c
Person: @.c
Person blushes furiously.
Klaudia Sparta: Sj?
Sjoerd Amdahl: I dont think it has to be around ones neck ,as it is in my view mainly a symbol I guess it could be anything, as long as both parties know the meaning of it
Klaudia Sparta: Welcome N:)
Person: hello N
Sjoerd Amdahl smiles as he sees Miss N enter the room: hi Miss :)
Person: Hello N
Klaudia Sparta: so true, my Boy, thank you for input
Klaudia Sparta: D?
Person: thank you Klaudia, helloE/everyone 
Person: no it can have many forms and places
Klaudia Sparta: that's current question, N:Collars can take many forms. They can be made of leather, they can be necklaces, they can be simple jewelery chains. They can be locked in place by Owner who keeps the key. But does collar have to be something what you put around your neck only?
Klaudia Sparta nods listening to D
Person: it can be just a clitring too.. it dpends on the Maser and wha the likes ... and how the sub .. or slave ... takes it
Sjoerd Amdahl grins
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you so much D
Person: my pleasure Klaudia
Klaudia Sparta: indeed, Collar does not need to go around the neck, although it's something most of us choose. But there can be reasons for which one can't wear something around their neck (sometimes it is related to our work, of course I mean RL) and in such case anything given and worn with the understanding that comes with the collar is perfectly valid and legitimate.
Klaudia Sparta: It can be for example body piercing (like labia rings, belly button ring), it can be bracelet or just ring on finger...
Klaudia Sparta: The collar around submissive's neck or other part of body is not the most important one though... The most signifficant and the most beautiful one is collar around their heart...
Klaudia Sparta: Actually there is beautiful quote applying to what I said: "Chains of steel will rust with time chains of the heart will only grow stronger" -Unknown
Person: Awww..
Person nods at Klaudia
Klaudia Sparta: lets move to next question....
Klaudia Sparta: Since the collar is reminder for us and others of what we are... is the sub without collar less submissive? Is she/he inferior in comparison to the collared sub? Do we lose our submission when we remove collar?
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: L?
Person: c
Sjoerd Amdahl: c
Person: I have issues when people use judgemental terms like inferior or less submissive. They are as submissive as they need to be. Each person has their own level of need... desire...
Klaudia Sparta smiles warmly at L, listening
Person: It really bothers me sometimes in the community when people say that someone is more Dom... or less sub... or whatever. Done.
Klaudia Sparta: thank you so much, glad you spoke about it
Klaudia Sparta: K?
Person: Being a submissive.. or a slave is within you. Circumstance does not make you more or less of one. What your true nature is does not change if you are unowned. Done.
Klaudia Sparta: thank you K!
Klaudia Sparta: Sj?
Sjoerd Amdahl: No, not at all I would say, it would be like saying that someone without a wedding ring would be less capable of loving someone... And I agree with Lilah when it comes to using words like inferior when speaking about people
Person ( shows off his uber dom tshirt to L)
Sjoerd Amdahl: done
Person giggles at T.
Klaudia Sparta: (lol my Master)
Klaudia Sparta: thank you my Boy
Klaudia Sparta: yes, submission is not something you can turn on and off like a faucet, it doesn't vanish with the moment you remove the collar...
Klaudia Sparta: welcome back A:)
Person: Welcome back, A.
Person: welcome back A
Klaudia Sparta: provocative question....
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: ok, but first T and his comment
Person smiles and hello R
Sjoerd Amdahl: hi R :)
Klaudia Sparta smiles and catches R
Person smiles at R... waving
Person: Hello L
Klaudia Sparta: Welcome Sir L
Person: I dont think that a collar is the ultimate show of anything, it is what is writ upon our hearts. am I less married because I dont wear my ring? amd I not a dom because I dont have my flogger or my crp? I think it is something of the heart and mind, and it matters not wether externally shown it is instead something prfoundly within. done
Person: Welcome R and L!
Sjoerd Amdahl nods in agreement with T
Person: I could not agree more T .
Person smiles
Klaudia Sparta: claps to T
Person: Greetings Sir L
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: very well said, thank you
Person: greetings all
Sjoerd Amdahl: hi L
Klaudia Sparta: A?
Person: hello Sir L
Person: I agree, wearing a collar does not make you submissive, any more than wearing a Mistress tag makes You a Domme,. ... its what/s inside you that counts ....
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta smiles warmly at Astrid, listening
Person: blushes shyly and looks down
Klaudia Sparta: is there more, dear?
Person: um...
Person: not really I could go on and on about Rpers versus lifestyler but will not side track the discussion
Person: so done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you A:)
Klaudia Sparta: N?
Person: I agree that a collar is just a collar and it doesn't alter how you are...but I also think that a collar is highly symbolic..
Person: and outward show of a commitment
Person: *an
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta: thank you so much N:)
Klaudia Sparta: back to provocative question
Sjoerd Amdahl listens
Klaudia Sparta whispers "does a Dominant wear a collar too?"
Person: c
Klaudia Sparta: T?
Person: a dominant in a very special way IS the collar, I am the ring around her heart, her neck, her soul. I dont have to wear one because I am one and am with her every moment, even if im not
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta: awwwww....
Person: c
Person: c
Person leans back against her Papi, smiling softly.
Klaudia Sparta: thank you T, you are lucky, L *winks*
Klaudia Sparta: my Master?
Person: if wearing a collar mean , the same level of devotion , understanding , love , care .. etc as the sub shows , then yes he wears one which is not to be seen
Person flashes a grin and knows she is...
Klaudia Sparta whispers "but to me I am luckier, Lilah" giggles and kisses Hand of her Master
Person glances at the time, I apologize gerntlemen, ladies, subs and slaves ... but I must put my babygirl to bed
Klaudia Sparta: are You done my Master?
Person: done
Klaudia Sparta: please take care T and L, thank you for coming!
Klaudia Sparta: coming over of course
Sjoerd Amdahl: good night T, and L, was nice to see you both
Person: thank you so much for coming over and we hope to see you both soon
Person smiles, "Thank you for having us!"
Klaudia Sparta: A?
Klaudia Sparta: awww and thank you for the tip, T:)
Person: good night Sir T and L
Person: bye Sir T, L
Person: is there a schedule of events?
Person: It was nice seeing you Sir T and L... i wish you both a good night.
Klaudia Sparta: and my Boy:) thank you:)
Klaudia Sparta: and L, thank you
Sjoerd Amdahl smiles at Her
Klaudia Sparta listens to A
Klaudia Sparta: We will have to finish when A is done, as it's already 2:31 am
Person: if a Domme wears a collar I walk away - I have no time for switchess...
Person: a proper Domme does not need to switch
Person: smiles at Astrid
Person: sorry was day dreaming
Klaudia Sparta giggles at A
Person: domme
Person: done
Sjoerd Amdahl: hmm
Klaudia Sparta: thank you for your input, A:)
Person: sorry girl feels strongly about that and meant no disrespect
Klaudia Sparta: alright, dear Ones, thank you so much for coming over and making this discussion so living